Legislature(1999 - 2000)
02/10/2000 05:10 PM House MLV
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 289 - TRANSPORTATION OF MEMBERS OF ALASKA NATL GUAR CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI announced the first order of business as House Bill 289, "An Act relating to transportation of members of the Alaska National Guard, the Alaska Naval Militia, and the Alaska State Defense Force by the Alaska marine highway system and the Alaska Railroad; and relating to the Alaska State Defense Force." Number 0056 REPRESENTATIVE JOHN HARRIS, Alaska State Legislature, came forward to present the sponsor statement. The bill mandates that the Alaska Marine Highway System [AMHS] and the Alaska Railroad Corporation [ARRC] provide free transportation, on a space-available basis, for members of the volunteer defense forces - the Alaska National Guard, the Alaska Naval Militia and the Alaska State Defense Force. It is expensive to travel to training areas because the state has such a wide area from which it draws its volunteers. The bill, therefore, would provide a cheaper way to get to those training areas on a consistent basis. The bill would also change the name of the Alaska State Militia to "Alaska State Defense Force." REPRESENTATIVE HARRIS referred to the fiscal note from the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities and pointed out that the $5-thousand figure is based on the assumption that vehicles are included. He thinks that the figure would be smaller because the bill does not allow for the cost of transporting a vehicle; it only allows for passengers. Number 0352 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KOTT asked Representative Harris why the term "militia" is being changed to "defense force." REPRESENTATIVE HARRIS replied the term is being changed in order to be consistent with the federal government. He pointed out that the defense force/militia is different than the national guard in that they can be called upon by the governor in the event of an emergency. REPRESENTATIVE KOTT asked Representative Harris whether the state would still have a naval militia. REPRESENTATIVE HARRIS replied the bill would not change the naval militia. Number 0457 REPRESENTATIVE SHARON CISSNA asked Representative Harris whether he can correct the fiscal note from the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities since there was a misunderstanding. REPRESENTATIVE HARRIS replied he can't correct it, but the department can. He will try to get a corrected fiscal note [from the department] before the bill reaches the House Finance Committee. Number 0513 THOMAS S. WESTALL, Brigadier General, 49th Civil Support Brigade, Alaska State Defense Force/Alaska State Militia, came before the committee to testify. The bill provides the Alaska State Defense Force, the Alaska National Guard, and the Alaska Naval Militia the use of a great facility. It gives them the opportunity to utilize forces in Southeast Alaska, when in the past they couldn't because of the extreme expense associated with moving those troops. He pointed out that they can't even be used at disasters in a reserve capacity, which causes somewhat of a strain on the troops that are committed. He noted that the defense force/militia has been at every disaster that the state has declared since 1986, and that they are at numerous other functions. He cited participating in community services, acting as a force multiplier for many agencies including the state troopers, and participating in Y2K [activities] as examples. He also cited that the defense force/militia furnishes the military police to help the Wasilla Police Department during the Iditarod restart, so that Wasilla Police Department doesn't have to uncover their regular patrols. GENERAL WESTALL pointed out that the defense force/militia has a unit in Fairbanks, two battalions in Anchorage, an aviation and medical detachment at headquarters [in Anchorage]. He further commented that the defense force/militia is held to 15 percent of their round-out strength because of a national guard regulation, which equates to 254 troops. In conclusion, he stated that the defense force/militia is proud of what they do, and they feel that the bill would help them do a better job. Number 0804 CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI asked General Westall to explain the reasoning behind changing the term "militia" to "defense force." GENERAL WESTALL replied the reason is related to the national guard being federalized. He explained, during that time, there was concern because the FBI [Federal Bureau of Investigation] was having trouble with organizations being called a militia by the media, thereby creating a bad connotation. He explained the title "Alaska State Guard" was tried, but it was too close to the identity of the Alaska National Guard. He further explained the authority granted to the national guard [32 U.S. Code Title 32] says that several states can have a national guard and a "state defense force," which is where the idea for the name came from. Number 1079 REPRESENTATIVE RICHARD FOSTER asked General Westall whether the defense force/militia's office is located in Anchorage. GENERAL WESTALL replied yes. The defense force/militia doesn't have full-time employees like the national guard, but they have volunteers on Tuesdays and Fridays to keep their personnel records continuous; they would be happy to show him around. Number 1157 REPRESENTATIVE BRIAN PORTER commented that he didn't know there was a place for old, retired military policemen. [The comment was followed by laughter.] GENERAL WESTALL pointed out that all of the defense force/militia's instructors train with police instructors who are certified with the state. He cited that Walter J. Gillmore (ph) is the operation and training officer for the brigade. Number 1230 WENDY LINDSKOOG, Director of External Affairs, Alaska Railroad Corporation [ARRC], Department of Community & Economic Development, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She indicated that there will not be any fiscal impact to the railroad as long as the term "space available" is interpreted to mean, "on the date of travel on regularly scheduled passenger service." She further mentioned that the ARRC has been linked to the military since its completion in 1923, which ultimately led to state ownership. The railroad is concerned about military personnel being bumped due to the availability of space. She cited as an example on a trip from Whittier to Fairbanks space might be available from Whittier to Anchorage but not from Anchorage to Fairbanks. It probably won't be a problem, however, if everyone involved remains flexible and understands that it could happen on occasion. Number 1334 CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI stated it appears that the railroad continues to serve the military by moving supplies and equipment. She asked Ms. Lindskoog whether it's correct to say that there already is a process in place to transport supplies and equipment for free. MS. LINDSKOOG replied the railroad does not move equipment for free. In relation to the movement of troops, she deferred the question to Laurie Herman from the Alaska Railroad Corporation. Number 1380 LAURIE HERMAN, Director of Passenger Service, Alaska Railroad Corporation, Department of Community & Economic Development, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She explained that on several occasions the railroad has worked with the military to determine a special charter rate to move troops along the Railbelt for their large exercises. Number 1420 REPRESENTATIVE FOSTER expressed his appreciation for the support of the ferry system and railroad corporation. He noted that this issue was brought up in 1992 at which time there was no support from either system. Number 1440 NORM EDWARDS, Captain, Operations Manager, Alaska Marine Highway System, Department of Transportation & Public Facilities, came before the committee to testify. He read the following into the record: We are happy to be part of ensuring Alaska's forces are being properly trained and ready for emergency deployment. There are some issues, however, regarding revenue generation and operations that the committee ought to be aware of prior to the passage of the bill, so that all parties involved have the same understanding and expectations of how the new law would be implemented. Since revenues are always a paramount concern for the Alaska Marine Highway System, our concern is first that the current travel being paid for by federal funds will now be lost to the state of Alaska. Second, that this free travel does not occur outside the state of Alaska. And third, that this new task does not become a burden for our operations. The Alaska Marine Highway System would hope that this legislation would allow operations complimentary to what we already do. To that end, our plans to implement this bill will include defining 'space available.' Space available means just that, space available on the same day of sailing. We will not make reservations in advance for this travel, for we cannot displace revenue-paying passengers or vehicles. Bumping space available does not guarantee passage for the duration of a voyage, if there is more than one link in the itinerary. For example, a Sitka passenger sailing on a space-available passage to Skagway could be bumped in Juneau, if fare-paying customers are waiting to sail on standby in Juneau. This person would have to disembark and wait for the next sailing with space available to proceed. Union contracts: Finally, our union contracts allow AMHS employees to sail on a space-available basis at any time and have a limitation on vehicle size. It is possible that a combination of AMHS employees and Alaska state military personnel will exceed the amount of space available. In that case, we will allow passage on a first-come, first-serve basis. Travel between Alaska ports only: We recommend a change in the language of Section 2, of the bill, that adds "between Alaska ports only" immediately after "the Alaska marine highway system." Those are the issues that we want to make everyone aware of Madame Chair, for the Alaska Marine Highway supports this bill in principle, and I would be happy to answer any questions. Thank you. Number 1580 REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA asked Captain Edwards how his testimony would change since the bill does not include vehicles. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied it would ease the restrictions. The greatest problem, he reiterated, is the carrying of vehicles, particularly in the summer when the car decks are full. Number 1606 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked Captain Edwards whether there is a standby list for marine highway employees to travel on a space-available basis, similar to how the airlines handle non-revenue passengers. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied it is based purely on available space. REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked Captain Edwards whether non-revenue passengers simply show up on the day that they want to travel and bet on the space available. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied, "That is correct." Number 1644 REPRESENTATIVE ERIC CROFT asked Captain Edwards to explain the Alaska-port to Alaska-port restriction. He imagines that most of the training would occur in state. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied the restriction was suggested because the ferry system believes the intent of the bill is from home-of-record to a point-in-state. He also mentioned that the out-of-state runs generate the highest revenues and have the least available space. REPRESENTATIVE CROFT stated he doesn't see that this would be a problem; most training would occur in state, but if a person needs to get to Prince Rupert for training and space is available then... Number 1686 REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA said there always seems to be extra room on the ferries for passengers without a vehicle, even during busy times. She asked Captain Edwards whether the ferries ever reach their limit. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied it's true there is extra room for passengers, but it's not nearly as true for vehicles. REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA asked Captain Edwards, What percentage of the time do the ferries reach their maximum limit? CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied not very often; it is in the single percentile. He noted that the Coast Guard sets the legal limit. Number 1772 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked Captain Edwards whether it's possible for someone to call a few days in advance to check the possibility of available space. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied, certainly, but it would take time away from those making reservations and compete with paying customers. Number 1809 CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI referred to the assumptions made by the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities in their fiscal note, and said she would be discouraged from getting on a ferry since she might get bumped. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied the fiscal note assumes that the bill included vehicles - the area of real conflict. He noted that there are people waiting in standby to get their vehicle on a ferry, and that the ferry system doesn't know what that list will be like until a ship gets in. CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI stated there must be a way to wait-list non-revenue passengers in order to provide some assurance. The airline industry does it all the time. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied the ferry system can give an idea of what the booking looks like, but that doesn't guarantee space, which is exactly how it works for their employees. Number 1926 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked Captain Edwards whether there is a reason for the Department of Transportation & Public Facilities to "not" submit a zero fiscal note since vehicles are not included in the bill. CAPTAIN EDWARDS replied, "I would say there is very little impact." REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked Captain Edwards whether that qualifies as a "yes." CAPTAIN EDWARD replied in the affirmative. Number 1942 REPRESENTATIVE FOSTER stated when he travels with an airline pass he is told that he might get bumped; it is based on available space. He said, "A guy takes his chances. You can't get something for free without a risk. And they were free trips, and I paid for it by getting stuck. But I didn't mind because they told me so." REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA stated it's important to remember that these individuals are traveling for training purposes in order to help fellow Alaskans in a time of crisis. She agrees with the concept of available space, but she also hopes that the people of the ferry system recognize and treat these individuals nicer in the spirit of patriotism; they are doing something for the state. CHAIRMAN MURKOWSKI closed the meeting to public testimony. Number 2038 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER made a motion to move HB 289 out of the committee with individual recommendations and attached zero fiscal notes. There being no objection, HB 289 so moved from the House Special Committee on Military and Veterans' Affairs.
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